Roots and Thorns in Waco, Part 2
A couple of weeks ago, I noted how Baylor had swept all meetings in football and basketball during the past academic year for only the third time since World War II, and posed this question: How long do the architects of the sweep, Art Briles and Scott Drew, figure to stay where they are?
In Part 1, I thought Briles’ tenure boiled down to two questions: Does he consider Baylor a "destination" job? And, if so, how long does he stay? Without a shred of inside information, my guesses were "he stays" and "8 to 10 years."
Turning now to Scott Drew, it seems to boil down to a single question: Does Scott Drew want to be Kelvin Sampson or Bobby Cremins?
Drew is 148–118 in nine seasons at Baylor, having resurrected the Bears after the Dave Bliss debacle. His tenure includes three NCAA trips (two trips to the Elite Eight) and one runnerup finish in the NIT. Given the vacuum of accomplishment before his arrival, he should be set for life? . . . Right?
Kelvin Sampson?
Sampson was impressively successful at Oklahoma. In 12 years, he averaged 23.3 wins and 9.1 losses. Except for an NIT appearance in 2004, all of his teams made the NCAA, including one Final Four (2002), one Elite Eight (2003), and one Sweet 16 (1999).
Those achievements were somewhat marred by a three-year NCAA investigation. Eventually, a report was issued that cited Sampson and his staff for making more than 550 illegal calls to 17 different recruits. Sampson, whose last year at OU was 2005-2006, was forbidden from recruiting off campus and making phone calls for one year between May of 2006 and May of 2007.
That report hit right as Sampson had left Oklahoma for Indiana, a member of NCAA basketball royalty. While Sampson may have needed to cut some corners to lure top prospects to Oklahoma, the Indiana job offered Sampson the same opportunity that Bear Bryant had when he went to Alabama. The Crimson Tide are members of college football royalty. Luring talent there was apparently easier for Bryant than it was at his previous job, Texas A&M. Bear had a clean record in 25 years at Bama whereas his four-year stay at Texas A&M included a two-year bowl ban for widespread rules violations, including players receiving money.
Under the curmudgeonly Bobby Knight, Indiana was known as a program that won while being squeaky clean. Whether Sampson could win there without cheating, we’ll never know. The month before his first campaign was to start, he was already in trouble for making impermissible phone calls at Indiana. Sampson was still restricted from making outbound recruiting calls yet he was caught taking part in 10 conference calls with recruits while one of his assistants made more than 30 impermissible calls. By February, the NCAA had charged Sampson with five major rules violations. Before March, he was gone.
At this point, Drew has been caught once. In April, the NCAA concluded a three-year investigation of Baylor’s men’s and women’s basketball programs, identifying 738 texts and 528 calls that were impermissible. The NCAA has stripped one scholarship per year for both the 2011-12 and 2012-13 seasons. Drew was also banned from coaching the Bears’ first two conference games next season. Additionally, the NCAA accepted an already self-imposed penalty where Drew and one assistant didn’t make any recruiting calls during the first two months of 2012.
Bobby Cremins?
Before examining the Cremins option for Drew, there are a couple of big differences between these two coaches. For one, Cremins was well-liked by his ACC coaching brethren. Drew and the Big 12? Not so much. Also, Cremins had a nice long run before his coaching shortcomings caught up with him. His teams made nine straight NCAA tournaments including a Final Four in 1990. Drew’s run includes four post-season tournaments in five years, and two of those were the NIT. A final difference between Cremins and Drew is that Cremins never got in trouble with the NCAA in his 34-year coaching career at five schools.
Where you can draw a parallel between these two coaches is that Drew's recent come-uppance from the NCAA puts him at a career crossroads that approximates where Cremins was in 1993.
Similarities? Both Baylor and Georgia Tech have iconic football coaches against which all future coaches are measured, Grant Teaff at Baylor and Bobby Dodd at Georgia Tech. The same is not true for basketball.
Before Drew and Cremins, the basketball history was sketchy at their respective schools. Between 1940 and Cremins’ first NCAA team in 1985, Georgia Tech qualified for exactly one NCAA tournament, that in 1960. The year before Cremins took the job, the Yellow Jackets went 4-23.
Baylor’s history is a tad richer, although most of it is in the distant past. Bill Henderson guided the Bears to the NCAA finals in 1948 and back to the Final Four again two years later. (One could argue that 1950 team was the worst to ever make a Final Four. In those days, the tournament field included only 16 teams so two wins got you to the Final Four. Baylor’s final record that season was 14-13.} In the 53 years between that Final Four and Drew’s first season at Baylor, the Bears made only one other trip to the NCAA tournament, that under Gene Iba in 1988.
Another similarity is that Drew and Cremins have pretty much the same strength: recruiting. Their idea of how to outwit the opposing coach is to put better players on the floor and let them figure it out.
What eventually brought Cremins to his crossroads is that the sales pitch that stocked his rosters with the likes of John Salley, Mark Price, Dennis Scott, Kenny Anderson, Travis Best, and others began to lose its appeal. That’s because it was based on how good things were going to be, how next year Tech would take the next step. However, by 1993, Cremins’ body of work was large enough for all to see what the ceiling was. Georgia Tech was good . . . but it was never going to be Duke or North Carolina. So from that point on, Cremins coached seven more seasons at Tech, making only one more NCAA tournament in 1996 and three NITs. If you exclude the ’96 season when the Yellow Jackets went 24-12 overall and 13-3 in the ACC, Tech’s average record was 15-15 overall and 6-10 in conference. After riding high for more than a decade in Atlanta, it took Cremins seven years of mediocrity to wear out his welcome.
So what’s it going to be?
Tha brings us back to Drew. If he doesn’t have a manpower advantage, he’s not going to outsmart anybody. I’m not sure he can sustain a talent advantage without bending some rules. There are kids who dream of playing for programs like North Carolina, Indiana and Kansas. Baylor is not in that fraternity.
So will Drew be like Cremins? Will he plod along without top drawer talent and wallow in mediocrity until the overseers in Waco decide enough is enough? Or will he be like Sampson, who didn’t know any other way to operate? Consider this. We don’t know how many of those 738 texts and 528 calls were for men’s basketball as opposed to the women . . . But what we do know is that the NCAA reviewed 900,000 messages over three years to find those 1,200 impermissible communications. Remember, it only took 10 calls (plus 35 by an assistant) to bring Sampson down.
My prediction is that within three years, Drew will cross the line again, perhaps even accidentally. I just think that’s just the way he’s wired. At that point, Baylor will have no choice but to pull the plug. Anyway, that’s my two cents. What’s yours?
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What really scares me,
is that Baylor, and therefore Drew, are combining a weird theology with their recruiting. I don’t want to go all theological/political here but, while I can respect Baylor University’s commitment to Faith and Family (etc), we have seen too much of what happens when those words come from the mouth of an objectionist (“Self interest is a moral imperative”).
So, yeah, I think Drew is more vile than Sampson, or even Switzer or Carrol, but only because he landed at a religious college that gave him a bigger, more important, vocabulary for his pitch. And unlike Sampson and so many others, when Drew is caught, some will say he is a christian martyr, because of where he works
by J-M-M on Jul 1, 2025 7:14 PM CDT reply actions
that is a SWC tradition
You can cheat if you have faith to absolve you (SMU) or an honor code
by codaxx on Jul 1, 2025 8:42 PM CDT via mobile reply actions
Very thought-provoking
Putting aside the debate as to whether Drew’s recruiting tactics are dirty or not…
Personally, I’m of the opinion that the more Big 12 schools that are nationally relevant, the better. Texas had the Oklahoma schools in the early 00’s, and Baylor and K-State have essentially replaced them in the public spotlight. The Bears essentially recruit players that Texas (for whatever wink reason) refuses to touch, so it’s not like there’s overlapping recruiting efforts within the state. Further, Drew is now starting to recruit nationally: Quincy Miller going to Baylor means Quincy Miller is not going to, say, a North Carolina school, which is also good news for the Big 12.
As for whether Drew can maintain a certain level of success at Baylor, the question really boils down to whether he can improve as a coach or not. Baylor’s recent success basically has been dependent on whether Baylor had more talent than the opponent. If they did, they would win; if they didn’t, they would lose. Sampson had arguably more success with the Sooners, and with lesser talent. I wouldn’t put Drew quite on that plane yet. It’s also worth noting that Baylor doesn’t have a notable prospect signed for 2013, after locking down Austin and Jones III ridiculously early in the ’10 and ’12 classes.
By the way, those impermissible phone calls that torpedoed Sampson and got Drew in hot water have pretty much gone the way of the dodo.
http://aseaofblue.com | https://www.barkingcarnival.com | @JC_Hoops
by jc25 on Jul 2, 2025 8:13 AM CDT reply actions
I was not aware of that rule change
And my initial reaction is to rethink Drew’s likelihood of getting into trouble. Then again, if everybody is texting, will Drew feel compelled to search for a newer frontier to get a competitive advantage?
But getting back to that rule change . . . Can you imagine the text traffic on the cellphone of a top 50 recruit? They’ll need two cell phones . . . one to handle recruiting traffic and the other for normal communication.
by Cirque Du Salado on Jul 2, 2025 8:30 AM CDT reply actions
My thoughts on the rule change
If you think back five years ago when cell phone plans weren’t unlimited, I think it was a much bigger issue. Nowadays, with unlimited talk/text, I think most high schoolers are pretty well versed when it comes communicating with coaches without any financial burden.
Further, the NCAA has no ability to regulate players’ communication with handlers or unscrupulous AAU coaches. If anything, I’d rather the player get more contact with NCAA coaches rather than backchannel communication through third-parties.
Finally, if a recruit really doesn’t want to hear from coaches, do like top recruit Jabari Parker. His dad effectively forbade any communication with Jabari. All coaches contact goes through him.
http://aseaofblue.com | https://www.barkingcarnival.com | @JC_Hoops
by jc25 on Jul 2, 2025 9:26 AM CDT up reply actions
Makes sense on all counts
As for Parker, that’s a great model but I’d bet that’s the exception.
by Cirque Du Salado on Jul 2, 2025 9:51 AM CDT up reply actions
I'm more concerned about Barnes allowing Texas to fall behind
by Joetx on Jul 2, 2025 10:18 AM CDT reply actions
Possibly
But I’d put Rick’s thumb speed about halfway between Rick Majerus and Josh Pastner.
by Cirque Du Salado on Jul 2, 2025 10:24 AM CDT up reply actions
It also bears mentioning that Baylor
has quietly assembled one of the dirtiest programs in NCAA basketball history over the last two decades, irrespective of who the head coach was. They’ve just been largely ignored because it was only recently that they parlayed it into wins. That suggests there’s something at work here much deeper than Scott Drew, Dave Bliss, or Darrel Johnson.
by Scipio Tex on Jul 2, 2025 3:37 PM CDT reply actions
It might even go back further
Carroll Dawson recruited a kid named Tony Rufus out of Memphis in the mid 70s. The Venn diagram showing Tony’s interests and Baylor was two circles about an inch apart.
by Cirque Du Salado on Jul 2, 2025 4:12 PM CDT up reply actions
Target
Why did the Baylor girl paint a target on her face?
by Big Mc on Jul 2, 2025 5:12 PM CDT reply actions
To give the tuba player something to aim for so she wouldn’t end up pregnant?
Did you read my comment, or did you merely see that it disagreed and begin composing your response immediately? by BrooklynHorn
by run Bevo run on Jul 2, 2025 9:40 PM CDT up reply actions 1 recs
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